Leifsland Wiki:Coordination
__NEWSECTIONLINK__ __FORCETOC__ You can talk in your language here, but English could be useful to prevent misunderstandings. Details So... We still got summing de do :o First of all: our location. I've thought about the Northern Atlantic, but any other ideas can be cute too. We need this figured out to understand our climate and shit :o Secondly, we need some population ideas. We don't want people setting up héruð with 10.000.000 inhabs, so I think we need to make a maximum. My proposal be that all provinces can start out with a population of maximum 100.000 and then have a slow growth rate as is usual in Europe. Our nation is founded on linguistic principles: they wanted to keep their language, they are not specifically religious, so they don't get 12 children de family :o Third, our politics (:o). I think it would be best that we all receive high autonomy. A few basic rules: the province has to be democratic republican-style (so no monarchy shit; remember we are a relatively young nation). We are a federation, so we need some kind of higher level politics. Any ideas? :o Cuntry size: how large we gonna be? :o So that basically most important :o --OuWTB 09:16, September 2, 2017 (UTC) Would we keep the list of provinces "open" in case new users want to join, or "finalise" it? 77topaz (talk) 10:23, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :Open. So the history needs to be kept flexible to allow that. --Semyon 11:09, September 2, 2017 (UTC) *@Location: North Atlantic is fine. Antarctica would also be cute. *@population: don't really care, but your proposal sounds good. *@high autonomy: goes without saying, otherwise it's be hell. @democratic republicanism: Varyagia is a theocratic monarchy. There is some level of democracy though. :P @higher level politics: yeah, let's have a 'coordinating council' which decides interprovince stuff. *country size: not fixed as we may have new provinces in the future, but probably very roughly number of provinces * 75.000. *additional note: I don't care very much about 'realism' and takavikiness that arises from the multilingualism. --Semyon 11:09, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :o So everybody just do summing like in Burenia? :P --OuWTB 11:15, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :No, that means I get nuked. :P (Actually I have admin powers, so I get to do the nuking this time. :P) --Semyon 11:17, September 2, 2017 (UTC) ::Icelandic is too cute to be nuked though :3 Nuking Luronesse is no problem though :P --OuWTB 11:34, September 2, 2017 (UTC) ::: :'( --QytokantFRÅGOR??? 11:45, September 2, 2017 (UTC) ::::Okay, now I'm curious to know which languages are "cute" and which aren't. :o 77topaz (talk) 11:47, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :::::Well, Limburgish definitely isn't :P --QytokantFRÅGOR??? 11:50, September 2, 2017 (UTC) ::::::Tsss.. Still not as bad as Brabantian though :P --OuWTB 12:02, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :::::::Brabantian isn't a language, though. It's just Dutch with a slightly weird accent and the word "toppie" added. :o 77topaz (talk) 12:04, September 2, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::Your version of Brabantian is takavíhki :o --QytokantFRÅGOR??? 12:05, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::That'd make it nukable though :P --OuWTB 12:05, September 2, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::::Tåpas, make a province which speaks Dutch with the word "toppie" added and we have summink de nuke :o --QytokantFRÅGOR??? 12:06, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::::No, I think it is takavíhki too. :o 77topaz (talk) 12:12, September 2, 2017 (UTC) "Toppie" doesn't seem to have page on the Dutch Wiktionary, and the English Wiktionary has it only as a completely different word in Afrikaans. Is it supposed to be spelled differently? ::::::::::::It's slang. --OuWTB 12:13, September 2, 2017 (UTC) I thought Wiktionary also included vernacular terms, though. 77topaz (talk) 12:16, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :Not if it's takavíhki and especially not if it's Brabantian :o --OuWTB 12:17, September 2, 2017 (UTC) I was thinking South Atlantic; I'm supposed to have a settlement at 54 South. horton11 13:57, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :Mayhaps your hérað just lies takavíhkily far away :o --OuWTB 14:01, September 2, 2017 (UTC) ::The north/north atlantic has already been done lots of times, so it would be nice to change area. Plus I was also looking to change land borders with 1-2 regions. horton11 14:05, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :::I need to change Cettatie to an archipelago. Just because something hasn't been done before doesn't make it nice; in fact, being bad is probably the reason it hasn't been done. Capitalize your ugly signature. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 17:05, September 2, 2017 (UTC) ::::Cettatie has nothing to do with this wiki; I was under the presumption that much like Sliras, it would occupy a place in some alternate, non-wikination universe. I meant share land borders (typo). That said, my page does not specify any more beyond the name of its southernmost location, which could easily work as being a meote territory much in the style of the Falklands could be an insular territory of Denavia. ::::To all: does @high autonomy include a military? horton11 17:27, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :::::I like Horton's idea, to be honest. It's a bit like Sliras, but maybe not an inverted Mobius strip. :P MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 00:04, September 3, 2017 (UTC) Hmm... would all our provinces be separate islands, or parts of one island? 77topaz (talk) 22:02, September 2, 2017 (UTC) : The French have their own island, but I was hoping to share land borders with others, ie. a large island. I plan to add islands to my province once I start a map. horton11 04:54, September 3, 2017 (UTC) ::Provinces being separate islands would make it easier to add more provinces later, but I guess some of the existing provinces could share a large island. 77topaz (talk) 07:29, September 3, 2017 (UTC) :::We can always have a fixed number together in a main island and beyond that in smaller ones. horton11 07:40, September 3, 2017 (UTC) ::::I agree it would be nice if some islands were shared by several different provinces. We can always leave parts of islands undescribed, in case someone creating a new province wishes to share land borders with other provinces. --QytokantFRÅGOR??? 09:51, September 3, 2017 (UTC) There is one very big reason why I think Northern Atlantic is more suitable, apart from the fact that I hate takavíhki warm climates that don't fit European culture. This reason is our history. We were started by immigrants who came from the USA, cuz they hated anglophonisation. Therefore, it makes sense we located close to USA þó :o --OuWTB 11:28, September 3, 2017 (UTC) :Aber es könnte auch sein, dass sie die USA so gehasst haben, dass sie möglichst weit entfernt wohnen wollten. :D Wäre logisch è. :P --Semyon 11:31, September 3, 2017 (UTC) ::Ég legg til að við séum nálægt Bouveteyju í því tilfelli :o --OuWTB 11:34, September 3, 2017 (UTC) :::Fine with me. --Semyon 11:42, September 3, 2017 (UTC) ::::You are aware there's an antarctic climate there though? :o --OuWTB 11:43, September 3, 2017 (UTC) :::::I'm fine with that. Our land mass could be large enough to have more temperate climates in the north and a more subpolar/oceanic in the south. I was thinking maybe Denavia could be the southernmost of the provinces, with our more insular region as our equivalent to Patagonia. horton11 16:46, September 3, 2017 (UTC) Que piensan... Os gustarian tener un chat en el wiki? O simplemente este u otros foros. horton11 17:59, September 2, 2017 (UTC) :Creo que podemos utilizar el chat de Lovia si lo necesitamos. --QytokantFRÅGOR??? 20:17, September 2, 2017 (UTC) ::Süper. horton11 04:51, September 3, 2017 (UTC) Allonomy So we all got pretty autonomous provinces now, but we need to figure out how we collaborate. It is somehow decided that Kraðakshöfn is our capital, but what is its function? :o I think we got the country for basic rules. This includes the Faeroe-Denmark kind of shit. So we basically need nationalised: military defence, the police department (mayhaps?), the justice department, currency and foreign affairs. Also, considering our low population, it could be good to have educational and medical institutes that fit together. Other shit we can decide for ourselves I guess :o --OuWTB 15:33, September 3, 2017 (UTC) :As long as Denavia gets to host our nation's main naval base we agree. On police, pro as long as we're allowed local police as well (esp in rural area. Pro on justice, currency (I can design it) and foreign affairs. Education and health too, if we go with a Nordic or even Chilean model. horton11 16:10, September 3, 2017 (UTC) ::Sounds good. Mayhaps the German province of Semyon wants to have the Supreme Court of the country? :o --OuWTB 16:12, September 3, 2017 (UTC) :::Yeah I can trust ze Germans with judicial stuff. horton11 16:26, September 3, 2017 (UTC) ::::Das wäre für uns eine Ehre. :) --Semyon 16:35, September 3, 2017 (UTC) Flags Should each province have its own flag, and then a national one? MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 03:31, September 5, 2017 (UTC) :That sounds sensible. 77topaz (talk) 03:50, September 5, 2017 (UTC) ::I've made some provincial flags already. MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 03:54, September 5, 2017 (UTC) :::You should post them here. :o 77topaz (talk) 11:50, September 8, 2017 (UTC) ::::I agree with Tåpas :o --OuWTB 12:55, September 8, 2017 (UTC) Currency and other questions Would we follow a Swiss model or Belgian model for our currency (neutral Latin inscriptions vs. all the languages on the coins)? horton11 19:28, September 5, 2017 (UTC) Secondly, would we have any indigenous peoples? horton11 19:28, September 5, 2017 (UTC) :Latin would be nice. I vote no indigenous peoples, because they will have languages which will need to be invented, but I won't prevent others doing as they like in their provinces. --Semyon 19:34, September 5, 2017 (UTC) ::Perhaps ypu can come to chat? Do have some questions to pose to you. horton11 19:37, September 5, 2017 (UTC) :::Considering our location: no, we ain't got no indigenous people. --OuWTB 09:29, September 6, 2017 (UTC) ::::Yeah, considering I think Burenia's are unrealistic, this would be the same. MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 04:40, September 7, 2017 (UTC) So, we decided no indigenous people. We still need to choose a name for a currency. 'Crown' would be the obvious but slightly boring choice, obviously translated into our languages. I rather like 'thaler.' Suggestions? --Semyon 11:49, September 7, 2017 (UTC) : For the Germanic nations crown would fit best, thaler too. But nor as much for the Latin ones, where something originating in Roman or Spanish currency might be better. horton11 18:40, September 7, 2017 (UTC) ::Then the currency would have entirely different names in the Germanic vs. Romance provinces, you mean? 77topaz (talk) 20:02, September 7, 2017 (UTC) :::No, but we base it off of Latin, ex. Solidus, where it could be Sol in Spanish and French, and Schilling in German, and Skilling or the Icelandic translation. horton11 20:22, September 7, 2017 (UTC) Strongly oppose Latin. Either all languages or English, the apparently agreed upon neutral language here, instead of a dead language. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 20:00, September 7, 2017 (UTC) : Latin isn't a dead language, far from it. The fact that it is not as used as other languages is no indication. Anyway, the Swiss use Latin for their coinage, and all four official languages on their notes, and seems like at least one other user here likes Latin for the currency. horton11 20:22, September 7, 2017 (UTC) : I like the Swiss model as well. It removes linguistic misunderstandings. MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 22:42, September 7, 2017 (UTC) ::@tm: english is ooc only as indicated earlier. Our nation is opposed to anglicisation ::@latin: anti. Icelandic is not best served with romance ugly words :o --OuWTB 07:42, September 8, 2017 (UTC) :::Since we have no Swedish-speaking province, I propose Swedish as an IC neutral language :o --QytokantFRÅGOR??? 10:49, September 8, 2017 (UTC) :::: :o Alternatively, we could use Limburgish as it's not even a national language :o --OuWTB 10:58, September 8, 2017 (UTC) :::::It seems Latin is not a popular choice. So either we have no words on our coins and notes, or we grant each province the right to mint their own monolingual money. @name: we still need to decide this. The shilling idea is rather nice but in my view not realistic; I think the names have to be similar to each other. I think króna/Krone/couronne/крона/corona works well in this regard, but it's boring. Also, it implies we're a monarchy - though I suppose it could be explained by the fact the Icelanders got here first. --Semyon 13:50, September 8, 2017 (UTC) ::::::Iceland uses "króna", but a republic since its start, so the name is purely history-based :o --OuWTB 13:59, September 8, 2017 (UTC) :::::::Franc is also an option, though франк looks takaviki in Russian. --Semyon 14:08, September 8, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::@Semyon: Maybe "Фрэнк" instead? 77topaz (talk) 21:02, September 8, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::No, that looks worse. :P Anyway, франк is the standard way to write it. --Semyon 21:06, September 8, 2017 (UTC) Just do what the Euro does, a short name that is used in all languages of a script, and give it in each script, and otherwise digits. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 17:07, September 9, 2017 (UTC) Okay, this discussion doesn't seem to be going anywhere. To me, króna/Krone/couronne/крона/corona seems like the best option, and I think Oos prefers it too, judging from the conversation I had with him earlier. Does anyone have an objection if we adopt it? --Semyon 17:53, September 9, 2017 (UTC) : There's no history and usage of couronne/corona among Romance language-speaking nations though. Perhaps the Euro idea might be best; make up a name that will be the same across all languages. horton11 18:09, September 9, 2017 (UTC) ::I think there is going to be no currency which has a history of usage across all languages though. As the Icelanders were here first, it does make sense that the rest of the provinces adopted their currency. Your idea is in theory okay, but I don't really like it and I suspect OWTB will hate it, because it's not compatible with Icelandic linguistic purity. --Semyon 18:40, September 9, 2017 (UTC) ::: :o --OuWTB 18:53, September 9, 2017 (UTC) Any other thoughts? --Semyon 17:59, September 11, 2017 (UTC) : Our own currencies then. We become a pre-Euro Europe. horton11 18:08, September 11, 2017 (UTC) ::I still prefer a nationwide currency though, but we need a name that is applicable to Icelandic :o --OuWTB 18:35, September 11, 2017 (UTC) :::Then we also need one applicable to Spanish, and then everyone would want one applicable to them. How about we just steal Libertas' Moneta and use that? horton11 18:43, September 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::Theoretically possible, but I strongly dislike such an ugly name (:o). We cud use summing like "plata" (which is used in Latin America) though :o --OuWTB 18:50, September 11, 2017 (UTC) :::::Plata means silver or money in Spanish though, it would be like calling it valuta or dinheiro. horton11 18:56, September 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::::Valuta not possible though, should be "völuta" :o --OuWTB 18:58, September 11, 2017 (UTC) :::::::It's a Dutch word. Swedish too. How about you make one specific to Icelandic rules, and the rest of us agree to a different one :o horton11 19:03, September 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::So.. we use "króna"? :o --OuWTB 19:17, September 11, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::Maybe you can but that doesn't fit Spanish grammar :o How about we just use Pesos and you add a couple umaluts and accents to icelandify it. horton11 19:22, September 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::::I'm okay with different languages having different names for the currency, but definitely not each province having its own. --Semyon 19:33, September 11, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::::Icelandic nouns on -o/-os very rare though :o We coud use "moneta"/"Münze"/"mynt" but that sounds takavíkhi. --OuWTB 19:59, September 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::::::I agree with Semyon that the names of the currency could be (slightly) different in different provinces, but there should definitely be one nationwide currency. 77topaz (talk) 20:14, September 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::::::::I support the name 'solidus' (shilling) to be translated into any language. On the currency it will be written in Latin. MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 22:38, September 11, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::::::::That seems like a good idea, considering how it can be translated into both Romance and Germanic/Nordic languages. 77topaz (talk) 22:46, September 11, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::::::::::No objection to the use of "shilling"/"skildingur". Highly object to the use of Latin on the coin :o --OuWTB 08:27, September 12, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::::::::::The problems with solidus are as follows: there are: 1) no real connection between the Romance and Germanic translations, except for a dubious etymological one, 2) no real history of usage in modern Romance languages (sou is the best I can come up with), and 3) no Russian translation. I guess if no one else finds these things problematic we can use it, but the Russian name will have to be rubl' or something. Speaking personally, I haven't yet seen a better suggestion than crown. --Semyon 15:42, September 12, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::::::::::::"króna" still the best to me. Other (often boring) international possibilities be "dollar"/"dalur" (thaler), "escudo"/"skúðu", "lira"/"líra", "mark", etc. --OuWTB 17:02, September 12, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::::::::::::I'm pro Escudo or even Lira. Kroner/Crown has no history of usage in Romance languages at all, so would not work there. horton11 17:31, September 12, 2017 (UTC) How about we just call it the "Leifer" or something along those lines? :o 77topaz (talk) 20:03, September 12, 2017 (UTC) :No objection (:o) De: Leifer; Is: Leifari; Fr: Leifère; Es: Leifro etc. --OuWTB 09:07, September 13, 2017 (UTC) Note I just noticed MOBS added some text to Kradackshafen, I believe using Google Translate. That's absolutely fine, but in future if you want to contribute but are not very confident in your language skills please add Template:Check to the page. --Semyon 14:43, September 8, 2017 (UTC) :Also, try to translate words separately in GT and then look for grammar on wikipedia etc. This way you actually learn summing :o --OuWTB 10:00, September 9, 2017 (UTC) ::Yeah, I was thinking about adding this to my previous comment: this wiki is actually supposed to be productive, compared to other wikinations, in that you gain some useful new language skills. Just using GT limits what you can learn very drastically. I recommend Linguee as well, as it gives you a lot of examples of the language in context. --Semyon 11:01, September 9, 2017 (UTC) You know what would be good... A Swedish province where all the names come from Ikea. horton11 04:55, September 11, 2017 (UTC) :That be Sweden. Most ikea names based on Scandinavian place names. --OuWTB 07:26, September 11, 2017 (UTC) ::Yeah, that sounds good. Can we call the capital 'Lufsig'? MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 09:09, September 11, 2017 (UTC) I feel as if this is still a good idea. MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 02:48, October 26, 2017 (UTC) We gon' let this wiki die too? :o It seems we becumming inactive again cuz Semyon a bitch right now :'( --OuWTB 12:47, September 19, 2017 (UTC) :Okay, I will aim to make one substantial mainspace edit a day, plus responding on talk pages. --Semyon 15:14, September 19, 2017 (UTC) :: :o Þú ert sætur þó :3 --OuWTB 15:30, September 19, 2017 (UTC) Just can't get motivated to do anything even though I want to learn more Germanic languages and get better at French and German. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 03:18, September 20, 2017 (UTC) :Þú latur þó :o --OuWTB 14:57, September 20, 2017 (UTC) ::Dann sollst du anfangen Artikeln über Ihnagau und Lüroness zu schreiben. Das wäre ein guter Anfang für dich --> Arbeitspartei. --Semyon 18:25, September 20, 2017 (UTC) :::Ja, aber ich kann motiviert nicht werden. :'( Vielleicht werde ich später schreiben. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 04:04, September 21, 2017 (UTC) ::::I'd offer to help with that particular page, but I only know German well enough to be able to (mostly) read it, not to write it. 77topaz (talk) 07:00, September 21, 2017 (UTC) What do you mean 'let it die'? It hasn't even been a month yet. MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 04:59, September 21, 2017 (UTC) Multilingual identical page names So we need one more solution for a problem :o Pages like Leifsland have names that are identical in some languages (German/Icelandic). I therefore propose that whenever such pages are created, the main page name, "Leifsland" be a disambiguation which lists all translations, while the pages themselves will be "Leifsland (Deutsch)" and "Leifsland (íslenska)". When a local translation is provided, all the links on pages in the respective language can be fixt to link to f.e. "Leifsland (íslenska)". :o --OuWTB 16:38, September 27, 2017 (UTC) :Fine with me. --Semyon 16:59, September 27, 2017 (UTC) ::Of course we can make exceptions for pages like Páll Magnússon. This would be mainly related to German articles, although an Icelandic translation makes sense. In this case I'd redirect "Páll Magnússon (Deutsch)" to "Páll Magnússon" and provide an Icelandic translation on "Páll Magnússon (íslenska)", which be linkt in the usual Template:Mul-form. --OuWTB 17:03, September 27, 2017 (UTC) :::Yeah I think this is common sense. --Semyon 17:34, September 27, 2017 (UTC) :::: :o --OuWTB 18:00, September 27, 2017 (UTC) ::::: I suppose this works. ~~~~ ::::::Why you nowikied your signature though? :o --OuWTB 09:52, September 28, 2017 (UTC) :::::::I can understand the Leifsland and central government pages done in other languages, but do we really need more pages in multiple languages, ex. Ackerness or Magnusson? Those could simply be linked to from Icelandic pages without the need for a separate article, where the (in this case) German original is likely to be the better-written and most up to date. horton11 15:42, September 28, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::Der Hauptzweck dieser Webseite ist für Benutzer Fremdsprachen üben zu können. Es ist eigentlich egal, ob sie Seiten von Grund auf schreiben oder übersetzen. Auch gibt's eine Vorteil, nämlich dass unsere Provinzen besser integriert werden. --Semyon 17:24, September 28, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::@horton: so you saying that because the Icelandic wikipedia doesnt have an article about f.e. prehistoric europe, while english does, none shud be written on icelandic cuz the english one better and more up to date? :o sounds like a fallacy to me and per Semyon. --OuWTB 17:41, September 28, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::also yr remark that my pages arent well-written is hurtful :'( --OuWTB 17:43, September 28, 2017 (UTC) Integration In order that our provinces become more integrated (not politically of course :o) I propose we create characters in each other's provinces. I already started here (I will make the article a bit longer, but not much :P). The articles will be quite stubby, but that doesn't matter too much. --Semyon 09:47, October 3, 2017 (UTC) : :o --OuWTB 10:01, October 3, 2017 (UTC) ::In what way is this going to be ingrating though? :P --OuWTB 10:05, October 3, 2017 (UTC) :::I mean that it helps people to be aware of other provinces rather than just working away by themselves. --Semyon 11:17, October 3, 2017 (UTC) ::::I think Innugey and Skaftgey pretty well integrated so far :o The main problematic things are inactivity or takavíhkiness :o --OuWTB 11:59, October 3, 2017 (UTC) Dead Unfortunately, for the first time, we have nothing in Recent Changes :o I suggest that several new pages be created to remedy this. Est-ce que vous êtes d'accord? MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 03:53, November 17, 2017 (UTC) :Put your RC on 30 days instead of 7 though :o --OuWTB 16:49, November 24, 2017 (UTC) ::That's true, but that's hardly a measure of activity. MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 01:22, November 25, 2017 (UTC) :::Lately there's been at least one edit every day though, so it's less dead than many other wikis :o --QytokantFRÅGOR??? 16:20, November 28, 2017 (UTC) ::::Just making a pointless edit to let the above remain true :o --QytokantFRÅGOR??? 20:02, November 29, 2017 (UTC) :::::Sounds a lot like the count forum on wikinazi :o --OuWTB 11:42, November 30, 2017 (UTC) ::::::Wikination. I'm starting to get quite worried about this. I suggest we make some town articles for Ihnagau. MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 21:54, November 30, 2017 (UTC) ::::::: :o We miss Semyon :'( --OuWTB 09:57, December 6, 2017 (UTC) Explaining Leifsland's history So what exactly happened with Leifsland's history? That's one thing I wanted to know. Here is a suggestion: *The country is named after Leif Eriksson, who legend has it came across the archipelago on his sea journeys in the 11th century. Even though he actually didn't. *The country was ACTUALLY founded in the 1810s and 1820s: Icelandic settlers came to Skaftgey because they wanted to preserve their language and culture, and Ihnagau was founded by German Catholics settled in America. Due to being unpopular with American Protestants, they resettled here. *In fact, all states of Leifsland were founded by settlers of a certain ethnic background, and often, a certain religion. They wanted a paradise, but it isn't always when your neighbours speak a different language to you. *In 1862 people decided that enough was enough, and Leifsland became a country. *Apparently, in Warjagien there was some religious war, which I don't really understand, in the 1900s. *The Parliament of Ihnagau was formed in 1924. I think we need to add more information, especially for Luronesse since it has no history yet. MyOwnBadSelf (talk · ) 23:19, December 24, 2017 (UTC) All should come due to wanting to preserve their language/culture. Skip the religious war. Add more German protestants. Add English speakers who oppose English spelling and/or want to create/preserve non-American culture. —TimeMaster (talk • ) 21:15, December 25, 2017 (UTC)